Something to ponder

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 11 May 2002 9:24 am

I host a Christian chat room on the Internet and this story concerns the steel guitar. Which I will share with you folks.

Last night a lady came into the room and shortly thereafter she posted,

"Does anyone play a musical instrument?"

I of course replied yes. She then asked what. I replied,

"you probably never heard of the instrument I play". Where upon she said, "Try me!"
So I gave the answer.

Well she and one other person (a man) replied in kind that they not only NEW what the instrument was but both of them liked the sound.

It was then that the man added something to it. And it was what he said that flabbergasted me.

He posted a number of long posts and I don't remember word for word what he said, so I will paraphrase his words as best I can.

He said, "I love the steel guitar, but MOST players overdo it and play badly".

Wow. That raised the feathers on the back of my neck. But, I decided NOT to defend it, and just listen. He went on,

"Most players hog the show. I was a Gospel DJ for a number of years, and while I love to hear the steel guitar played when it is played well, most of them played badly and they played too loud and hogged the show!. But for those who play good, I love it!"

Later, I began to ponder what he had said. I had never heard ANY one say this before. EVER!

But I wonder. Is he a LONE wolf in the wilderness? Was he a crackpot who was just trying to be a smart "aleck"? Are there others that feel this way but have not told us? If there are others, how many are there out there?

Anyway, it is something to ponder.

carl

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 11 May 2002 9:39 am

Here's one interpretation...

With most people I talk to, when I tell them I play "steel guitar" they think I meant "steel-stringed guitar". So... that's my hypothesis! Most "steel-stringed guitarists do play badly and hog the show! LOL!

(Hey... it was just a guess...)

Rex Thomas · Post by **Rex Thomas** » 11 May 2002 9:47 am

Hi, Carl. Yeah, I know where he's coming from. I just have some thoughts that come to mind: Team ball vs. grandstanding, consideration vs. flippant, confidence vs. out of control ego, sharpshooter vs. "all ammo & no target", etc. That "overdo it" disease isn't exclusive to steel. I'm not going any particular direction here, just thoughts. Also, in my career I've noticed that a good leader is a good follower. And vocally or instrumentally, you can make a statement, or be a blabbermouth. Speaking of blabbermouth, I think I've said enough. Bye.

Larry Miller · Post by **Larry Miller** » 11 May 2002 9:48 am

Carl, yes I have heard this before. Not many people (other than steel guitar players) could listen to CD with nothing but steel guitar as the main instrument. Jeff Newman said

"No matter how well you play, there is a limit to how much pedal steel guitar the average audience can digest without it leaving a bad taste in their mouths."

we are lost in the forest and can't see the trees, or maybe vice versa.....but I love the steel guitar!!!

RON PRESTON · Post by **RON PRESTON** » 11 May 2002 10:11 am

Good point, Carl,
The band I play for looks at me as if to say..."When are you going to PLAY that thing"?

I simply WILL NOT OVER PLAY...I hate it. I like it when I HAVEN"T played for lets say, the 1st verse, 2nd verse, and THEN come in on the "bridge" with a Smooth lick that takes the crowd by surprise. They look around, (if they just got there ) and I'm sure they are thinking, "What IS that sound?
I LOVE to see peoples faces in the crowd when they have heard a steel for the 1st time.
I must admit, though, it is TOUGH to NOT play when EVERYONE is having a "FREE-FOR-ALL"
Enough Said.
Ron

Ray Montee (RIP) · Post by **Ray Montee (RIP)** » 11 May 2002 10:18 am

I think this is a great topic.....and I fully realize that by responding, that I might be subjecting myself to still another barrage of critical emails........however:
Putting aside the fact that I have played steel guitar for many years....., I do have to agree (in part) with the comments submitted by the gentleman DJ to whom you, Mr. Dixon, have referred.
Understand that I truly realize that we all started from nothing and after many years of frustration and pain staking study and practice....that we have managed to acquire a certain level of expertise on our beloved instrument. (I'm still a basic student, grasping each day with a new idea or "lick" that until now, I've not been able to figure out.)
I have however, during recent years, experienced so many instances where current steel players, playing in a working band ...have displayed a definite lack of many of the basic qualities that many of us consider to be essential if one is to be considered a real professional player.
Playing too "SOFT" barely audible is often a factor. The other extreme is "TOO LOUD" and walking all over the vocalist and/or others in the group. Background playing that is distracting and cumbersome
and lends little to the presentation.
The once popular vision that the job of the steel guitarist was to enhance the song and the singer then shine on oneself during their instrumental break.....has all but vaporized, it would seem. Today, many steel players seem to be in some kind of never-ending CONTEST to show someone (a friend, perhaps) in the audience that they are the FASTEST, LOUDEST, MEANEST picker in the nation. Loaded down with gimmicks and gadgets.......many still can't tune their own instrument let alone, figure out how to get in tune with the other band members instruments.
I've witnessed crooked bars above the frets; out of tune chords BEFORE the pedals were depressed and it only got horribly worse when the pedals were applied. The most expensive equipment and electronic accessories accompanied by a daffy hat or whatever, does not a steel player make.
IMHO, for what it's worth, the belief that just any Tom, Dick or Harry, can sit down behind a modern pedal steel and play it after just 3-6 months of practice time.....and make it sound like a true professional, I believe, is a disservice not only to MUSIC......but to the public as well.
Musicians long ago learned at an early age that to be successful, one had to play to the public's likes/dislikes (commercial) and not exclusively to their own selfish musical tastes.
A lot of those old, time worn "values" seem to be less apparent today, in many steel guitar pickers. A great place to experience these diversities is at any one of the many steel jams around the country.
Okay! Send all of your criticism/email as I'm turning off my 'puter for seven days.

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 11 May 2002 10:32 am

Um... so, I guess you guys don't think it was all a big misunderstanding...

Rex Thomas · Post by **Rex Thomas** » 11 May 2002 10:57 am

I'm with you, Jim!

This person could be referring to one of them there bowx gitawrs. Then you've got the lead vs. rhythm issue, & I'm leaving that alone. Y'all don't need anymore fire from me.

Bobby Boggs · Post by **Bobby Boggs** » 11 May 2002 10:58 am

Tom Bradshaw wrote a piece many years ago that caused a big stink.He mentioned something like he felt that players that played bad.Out of tune,etc etc were holding the instrument back.Steel Killers I think he called it.I'm not sure I disagree.

A lot of folks feel as long as there is a PSG on stage, especially big time TV that it's good for steel guitar.No matter how bad or out of tune the player is.However a lot of these folks seem to be PSG builders or dealers.No, I'm not talking about Robert R. I'm a fan and I think a lot of us will make more money if Robert hits in a big way.I was thinking more of some of the rock and country players.The ones that play steel as a 2nd or 3rd instrument.And don't play very well. Just my 2 cents. -------bb [This message was edited by Bobby Boggs on 11 May 2002 at 02:23 PM.]

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 11 May 2002 11:05 am

Carl-There is a lot of truth in dem dere statements.
That's all I'm going to say....al

John Steele (deceased) · Post by **John Steele (deceased)** » 11 May 2002 12:04 pm

I'm 100% behind Ron Preston on this one. I think we both have the same approach.

Without darkness, we would not know light

-John

Del Rangel · Post by **Del Rangel** » 11 May 2002 3:16 pm

If he was a gospel DJ he must have known a bit about CW style gospel music as well as Sacred Steel/House of God focus. I guess my question is this, How much of what he is saying is specific to his musical focus in the past--e.g. gospel?

Rick Collins · Post by **Rick Collins** » 11 May 2002 3:19 pm

The gentleman was right, of course; but this also applies to lead guitarist and especially to drummers. What really bugs me is for any instrumentalist to play the melody behind a vocalist instead of tasteful fills and runs,___I have heard it from players who know better and do it anyway.

Rick

Bob Hayes · Post by **Bob Hayes** » 11 May 2002 5:49 pm

I think we've had this discusion before. I realized a long time ago that I was JUST a side man...but a Band player.. That is do what I had to do to further the best interest of the band. Weather it was strictly back up and shareing lead breaks, doing harmony or doubling on rhythm or lead guitar. A lot of "New or Top 40 country, with some standards and a lot of Southern Rock and rock 'n'roll..What you call you're"Working Bar bands"..Also doing the "animal circuit" I NEVER considered myself an "instrumentalist". I would only get a chance to play an instrumrntal every now and then..and then it was "The Rag" or Last Date, or Maidens Prayer. Now3 I'm playing basicly "Traditional Country" and learning more instrumentales..and the aproach and work ethics to become a profiecient picker. But I WILL ALWAYS REMEMBER. "I" AM NOT A BAND!!!.It takes the whole group that is playing to pull it off. My head size is only 6 3/8ths..and I hope that it dosn't get any bigger..especially when I play!!
MHOP
GV

Chuck McGill · Post by **Chuck McGill** » 12 May 2002 6:49 am

Have you noticed the players personality
off stage is usually the same.

Roger Kelly · Post by **Roger Kelly** » 12 May 2002 8:47 am

Carl... this so called "Jockey" who played Gospel Disks that contained "Badly Played Steel Guitar" is certainly entitled to his Opinion....no matter how "Oddball" it seems to me.

Steve Feldman · Post by **Steve Feldman** » 12 May 2002 8:57 am

Without darkness, we would not know light

Miles Davis comes immediately to mind. That guy got more mileage out of not playing than anybody I can think of. Well, you know what I mean - The guy knew how to make empty space a part of his palette.

Barbara Hennerman · Post by **Barbara Hennerman** » 12 May 2002 9:08 am

I remember one night in a club, we were playing a trio (bass, drums and me)and this guy came up and said, "Why don't you be still and let the guitar player have some fun. I hate keyboards". OKAY!!!

Tony Palmer · Post by **Tony Palmer** » 12 May 2002 9:34 am

Very interesting topic...can be interpreted many ways.
One problem with the (pedal) steel guitar is it is not much of a rhythymn instrument, let's face it...it is a lead instrument mainly. Yes, I know, we can all play rhythymn backups, but it simply is not the same as a keboard or 6 string.
Plus, the sound of a steel is so distinctive, you always hear it clearly when it is playing, as opposed, again, to a keyboard or 6 string which can easily blend in the background.
This leaves us players with the responsibility to play with more self control than other instruments and those who don't, will, I agree, be accused of OVERPLAYING!!

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 12 May 2002 9:42 am

Yeah, Steve-

Most lead instrument players and at least half the rhythm players play way too much. They could all learn something from Miles. There's a great story about Miles trying to get Thelonious Monk to lay out while he (Miles) was soloing on some session.

I don't want to hear a bunch of walk-ups and walk-downs and pushes and licks while I'm playing my part, unless it's rehearsed. Damnit, Beavis, shut up while I'm playing!

C#

Joerg Hennig · Post by **Joerg Hennig** » 12 May 2002 12:31 pm

Referring to Tony´s post,
Sometimes, when I listen to some of the greatest guitar/steel duos (and I mean those where almost all agree on, like Rhodes/Charleton) I get the impression that the guitar and steel in certain spots blend together so well that it´s almost hard to tell one from another.
Also, I´m sure that many will not agree that the steel is so limited as a rhythm instrument. It´s all about how it´s being used. But there are probably not very many players who know how to do it really well.

Mike Perlowin RIP · Post by **Mike Perlowin RIP** » 12 May 2002 7:12 pm

One problem with the (pedal) steel guitar is it is not much of a rhythm instrument

With all respect, I must take issue with this. It is not that the steel isn't as good a rhythm instrument as any other, but that most steel players dont know how to play rhythm. The same can be said for a lot of guitar players too.

Depending on what the other players are doing, I either play "chinks" up the neck on the off beats, or full chords in the bass register (one of the the advantages of a universal tuning.)

The steel guitar is first and foremost a guitar, and can do almost anything a standard guitar can do. The only limits are the players' abilities and imaginations.

John P. Phillips · Post by **John P. Phillips** » 12 May 2002 10:51 pm

To settle all the above posts, just listen to Buddy with a little more attention. The man can just about do it all. Follow and learn from a master, and you'll know how it's done. My 2 cents worth !! As Reece says, It's not practice, but perfect practice that makes perfect !!!

------------------
"Let's go STEEL something"
If it feels good, do it. If it feels COUNTRY, do it twice
jpp

[This message was edited by John P.Phillips on 12 May 2002 at 11:52 PM.]

Al Vescovo · Post by **Al Vescovo** » 13 May 2002 9:17 am

In my opinion,in order to speak,you have to
listen, and answer why, when, where, and how.
To some players it comes from the soul naturally,but, for all players it takes practice, dedication and awareness. You know, you do speak through your Steel.
Al

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 13 May 2002 12:19 pm

I wouldn't lose any sleep over what the chat-room guy said, Carl. If he really "loved the steel guitar"...he'd be playin' one!

Or, at the very least, he'd be a serious listener, and would have been better able to convey his thoughts about "overplaying, and playing badly".

Those that don't play...well, they just don't understand...and they never will. Be nice to them, and ignore what they say...unless they're paying you.