Simple Question

George Kimery · Post by **George Kimery** » 21 Jan 2021 4:47 pm

Do players that are good know they are good as well as players that are bad know they are bad?

James Sission · Post by **James Sission** » 21 Jan 2021 5:36 pm

Bobby D. Jones · Post by **Bobby D. Jones** » 22 Jan 2021 4:41 am

Let someone record you, You will know real quick which group you belong in.

George Kimery · Post by **George Kimery** » 22 Jan 2021 7:02 am

Bobby, good suggestion.I used to sing when I was 18-20 years old. A few friends were trying to be kind and told me I had a pretty voice. They avoided saying I could sing good. When I recorded my singing for the first time that ended my singing career. That was over 50 years ago and I haven't sung a note since.

I used to record every single band gig. Sometimes when I listed back, I thought I did pretty good. Other times, not so good. I quit and haven't recorded anything in several years. It was affecting my playing and enjoyment. I was too concerned about not making a mistake and/or how something would sound on the recording to be creative and to stretch out and try new things. Band members wanted me to make CD's of the shows for them. I think they may have held back knowing they were being recorded. I now limit my recording to myself at home for trainng purposes.

Paul King · Post by **Paul King** » 22 Jan 2021 7:30 am

My first steel guitar record was "Hal Rugg Steels The Hits Of Loretta Lynn". I had a friend tell me if you ever think you are getting good just pull this record out and listen to it again.

Richard Lotspeich · Post by **Richard Lotspeich** » 22 Jan 2021 5:22 pm

My desire ,after finishing ANY gig Ive done---is for the people that were there to say "he sounded good,knew when not to play,and was a help to the GROUP" Most groups in this area dont really have a need or desire for a steel player anymore. I did a recording (first) in 19 with a friend that needed steel. Hes a great musician and I was a touch on edge. I was amazed at how much I sucked through headphones. Many variables there. It was awful at first but got some better with time. But atleast I knew it,,,lol.

Marco Schouten · Post by **Marco Schouten** » 23 Jan 2021 6:49 am

Paul King wrote:My first steel guitar record was "Hal Rugg Steels The Hits Of Loretta Lynn". I had a friend tell me if you ever think you are getting good just pull this record out and listen to it again.

I play Greensleeves everyday,sometimes I have the illusion that I'm playing it pretty well.....but then I listen to Emmons version on the Black Album and I'm with both feet on the floor again.

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 23 Jan 2021 7:44 am

I'm not as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was.

Erv

Bill L. Wilson · Post by **Bill L. Wilson** » 23 Jan 2021 9:28 am

The people that are exceptionally talented musicians know they can produce in any situation. I always admire the things Paul and my favorite piano player of all time, Hargus “Pig” Robbins come up with. Experience and a great ear are the two things most of us don’t have.

Chris Brooks · Post by **Chris Brooks** » 23 Jan 2021 9:43 am

Erv !!!

Jim Cooley · Post by **Jim Cooley** » 23 Jan 2021 9:59 am

At the risk of being a little off topic, I wonder if the pros do this. I recently started recording songs or parts of songs on my phone. I initially used the recordings to compare amp settings and speakers. However, I soon started noticing a note I didn't realize was a little flat or sharp, or a phrase that doesn't sound as good as I thought it sounded when I played it. I even occasionally hear something that sounds better than I expect, and that helps too. Listening to the recordings also sometimes gives me ideas for alternate voicings and phrasings.

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 23 Jan 2021 11:14 am

It depends what is the definition of good.

I think professional players know they are capable and can deliver what's needed in any situation. I don't believe they're too concerned with how "good" they are.

The more you know about music in general, the more comfortable you will be in an unfamiliar environment.

That is what I've always strived for. To educate myself musically to the point I feel comfortable playing in all types of situations. Not that I haven't fallen short many times, but I'm definitely painfully aware of it.

I try not to pass judgement, but I have heard players struggle that have been playing for a long time and I do wonder if they realize just how lacking they are.

Concerning recording, I never like to hear micelf. I have only a few times that I was ever satisfied hearing myself in playback. I guess that should tell me something about the second part of your question.

Curt Trisko · Post by **Curt Trisko** » 23 Jan 2021 1:10 pm

Jerry Overstreet wrote:I think professional players know they are capable and can deliver what's needed in any situation. I don't believe they're too concerned with how "good" they are.

My thoughts on reading this thread go in a similar direction. The pros can deliver across the board. For the rest of us, it may be more a matter of knowing what you do well and what you just don't have. Shining with what you do well and taking a measured approach with what you don't are virtues.

Paul Sutherland · Post by **Paul Sutherland** » 23 Jan 2021 2:49 pm

"Know they are good" sounds arrogant, but "confident in their abilities" is what you should expect from a professional.

Sometimes I'm confident, and sometimes I'm in over my head on a particular song.

If I play another 50 years maybe I'll always be confident.

Damir Besic · Post by **Damir Besic** » 25 Jan 2021 6:46 am

I know some great players working day jobs to survive, and I know some less than average players who make bunch of money just playing music ... that was before this covid bs tho

Rick Barnhart · Post by **Rick Barnhart** » 25 Jan 2021 9:15 am

George Kimery wrote:Do players that are good know they are good as well as players that are bad know they are bad?

Simple answer...yes!

Ken Boi · Post by **Ken Boi** » 25 Jan 2021 11:50 am

George Kimery wrote:Bobby, good suggestion.I used to sing when I was 18-20 years old. A few friends were trying to be kind and told me I had a pretty voice. They avoided saying I could sing good. When I recorded my singing for the first time that ended my singing career. That was over 50 years ago and I haven't sung a note since..

On the other hand, don’t sell yourself too short. There is a lot of talk that John Lennon (Beatles) did not like his singing voice. Maybe he didn’t have the greatest singing voice in a traditional sense, but taken in context of his great songs and recordings he can be considered as having a very good singing voice.

Bruce Bouton · Post by **Bruce Bouton** » 25 Jan 2021 2:02 pm

I'm always checking myself. I just saw a video I did where I was able to see my left hand. Man, I've developed some bad technique. Now I'm acutely aware of it and I think it's helping me get better. It takes a lot of years to get comfortable on an instrument. I'm amazed at how many great players I know that don't realize how good they are.

Serious players think are never good enough and are constantly striving to improve their playing.

Justin Emmert · Post by **Justin Emmert** » 25 Jan 2021 2:27 pm

All you have to do is record yourself, preferably to a high quality in tune track. That’s all you need to humble yourself.

Bruce Bouton · Post by **Bruce Bouton** » 25 Jan 2021 4:48 pm

Bruce Bouton wrote:I'm always checking myself. I just saw a video I did where I was able to see my left hand. Man, I've developed some bad technique. Now I'm acutely aware of it and I think it's helping me get better. It takes a lot of years to get comfortable on an instrument. I'm amazed at how many great players I know that don't realize how good they are.

Serious players are constantly striving to improve their playing.

James Sission · Post by **James Sission** » 26 Jan 2021 6:46 am

Bruce Bouton wrote:Serious players think are never good enough and are constantly striving to improve their playing.

That statement is strongly supported in the the dialog between Tommy White and Paul Franklin on Paul's interview video.

Fred Treece · Post by **Fred Treece** » 26 Jan 2021 10:11 am

James Sission wrote:
Bruce Bouton wrote:Serious players think are never good enough and are constantly striving to improve their playing.
That statement is strongly supported in the the dialog between Tommy White and Paul Franklin on Paul's interview video.

So, isnâ€™t it good enough for all of us? That statement works for me, even though I am not a great recording artist and never will be. Itâ€™s just silly for me to compare my playing to Hal Rugg or Buddy Emmons. I guess thatâ€™s the simple answer to the OP question.

I measure my progress by the way it feels when I play. I donâ€™t have to record my every performance to know that some of them were good for my level and some of them sucked. Enough â€œfansâ€ have done crappy recordings of my band on their phones and posted the horrifying result on social media the next day for me to realize that making them happy is not always about me being my musical best. That doesnâ€™t stop me from wanting to grow with the instrument and really working at it, whether my friends notice or not. Why? Because itâ€™s more fun to play when you get better at it.

Rick Campbell · Post by **Rick Campbell** » 26 Jan 2021 6:30 pm

I've never done anything music wise that I was totally satisfied with.

RC

Kevin Fix · Post by **Kevin Fix** » 26 Jan 2021 8:16 pm

"SAME AS ERV" I recorded myself with groups I was with over the years. Was great medicine for my hands, knees and feet. It taught me what not to do and what to do better.

George Kimery · Post by **George Kimery** » 27 Jan 2021 7:32 am

Rick, I feel the same way. I have played at a few steel shows and only one did I think I played as well as I can. I felt good about that, but still wasn't totally satisfied. If I ever get to the point I'm totally satisfied, that will mean I've eat the carrot that is always dangling in front of my face driving me on. I fear I would lose interest because the challenge would be gone. As I have learned my way around my guitar a lot better, that has brought on a new problem. Now I can play things multiple ways and now I have to decide which way sounds the best. One way may sound best here at home, but I have concerns that another way may cut though the mix and sound better with the band. I'm a total amateur and steel guitar is simply a 50 year hobby. I should just play the best I can and enjoy it, which I do, and be satisfied. I think I take it way too seriously.

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